mcgowanjm wrote:PO is when debt can no longer be created.

All available energy is being used to service old debt.

The remaining debt must then find a CounterParty or be extinguished.

mcgowanjm wrote:The EndGame is ALL Bonds go to ZERO % rates.

mcgowanjm wrote:That being said, then who wants ANYTHING but Short Term Zero Duration Bonds: Or the Actual Currency of the Sovereign.

The Sovereign being the EMpire. The Empire's Currency?

The $*.....8D

*- The Actual Hold it in your hand $....8D

mcgowanjm

OldNorseman wrote: Take Chinas sale of 4 millions new cars per year. If they are going to use them as well, demand might outstrip supply, without the world even being at peak oil.
And we could even have expansion of credit at PO. Wouldn't money printing (in the form of credit expansion)/currency devaluation be an easy method for TPTB to allocate funds/money to the sectors they prefer?

China cannot 'use' the cars it makes. Not yet. And the world demand for cars is
crashing. Demand is Always easier to crush than to find new supply.

Again, if we have credit expansion, which we now have the opposite of (see GreecePortugal today) then we're not at the asymptote of PO, which we passed IMHO May 2000(Deffeyes).

As long as no 'zero's' are added to the Ben franklin, it's impossible to print more than
$6 trillion worldwide. Meaning, with the World's fastest presses, the USSA can barely maintain Status Quo on how many $$$ are in circulation.

As opposed to $1.7+ Quadrillion in Debt Derivatives.

Further, when the State allocates 'resources', it by definition creates a Command Economy TBTF Entity. The same Entity will husband ALL resources received from the State, knowing the true precariousness of the Financial System. See All Euros created since 2008 have been parked at the ECB.

mcgowanjm wrote:The EndGame is ALL Bonds go to ZERO % rates.

Absolutely true. When the machine does not produce more than it consumes, how can there be any yield on investments? I can't see how our societies will handle that situation. War?

War

mcgowanjm wrote:That being said, then who wants ANYTHING but Short Term Zero Duration Bonds: Or the Actual Currency of the Sovereign.

The Sovereign being the EMpire. The Empire's Currency?

The $*.....8D

*- The Actual Hold it in your hand $....8D

mcgowanjm

Can't understand what you mean here, could you please expand: "The $*.....8D"

You got it. The ability to produce actual cash money on demand.

Isn't the dollar bill in reality a zero rate bond? Hardcore deflationistas hold that during collapse, the dollar will get extremely strong, and physical money will get extremely valuable. USD is perhaps doomed in the long terms, but it will be "the last man standing".

I think many people confuse paper assets, credit money and physical money.

That would be the FedRes doing that. Cause that's their job.

Fekete:


At the present junction the Fed is buying bonds to combat deflation. Bond speculators know this, will buy the bonds first, driving down interest rates in the process. The result is more deflation, not less.

Everyday now, the $1.7 Quadrillion in debt derivatives (since ReaganGreenspan1982)
are being crushed by Fekete's quote above. The BalticDry Index has fallen to Jan 09 lows. Meaning All Global Trade is freezing up. No Chinese cars/products being exported.

Energy is the Only resource that can be moved now, and that more not much longer.

To a large degree they are fungible, at least during normal times - inflationary scenario. You can buy a car with both credit and physical money. But during deflation, you might loose your money when the bank goes bust. You can loose your pension nest egg if the stock market crashes. But physical money doesn’t deflate. If you find that physical money is being hoarded/hard to get hold of, you know that there's a big crunch ahead.

Physical $ is being hoarded. Credit Contraction under way now and increasing.
CounterParties must be matched or the debt liquidated. That's deflation.
You will have hours to move your money into your actual hands when the Bank runs
(personal, the Institutions Bank runs have already started.

That's why TPTB are so afraid of deflation. The way to get rich is in reality to short the dollar. Until deflation comes.

No. Politely, but firmly No. The Ultimate wealth of the Top 400 is humans.
Before that it's a strong $, the currency of the USSA.

The Top .01% must have a Strong $, but they can't all have it. If they look to be hoarding it,
they increase the Prisoner's Dilemma of crashing the system. It cause them a lot of stress.

The Top .01% must have a Strong $, but they can't all have it. If they look to be hoarding it,
they increase the Prisoner's Dilemma of crashing the system. It cause them a lot of stress.

And all this while trends in the - overcast - horizon point to what could be dubbed an Asian Dollar Exclusion Zone, which for many sharp minds in the developing world might pave the way for an energy-backed currency used by the BRICS and the Group of 77 (G-77) to counter the increasingly desperate - and clueless - Atlanticist West.

Back to the European poodle parade, one just has to examine the joint statement issued by these mediocrity monstrosities - British Prime Minister David Cameron, German Chancellor Angela Merkel and neo-Napoleonic "liberator of Libya", French President Nicolas Sarkozy.

The trio said, "We have no quarrel with the Iranian people." Iraqis heard exactly the same thing from another set of mediocrities in 2002 and 2003. Then their country was invaded, occupied and destroyed.

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/NA26Ak02.html